esa appeal im scared!!

barnesy

Hi everyone, I'm new to this forum but not to RA and PA having been diagnosed some 20 plus years ago! I have my appeal for ESA on 27th June and I've never been so scared I feel my whole future and daughters future will be decided on that day. Does anyone else feel like a criminal having to defend themselves for being ill? I take 16 tablets per day without painkillers just to get up in the morning and 24 one day a week (8 methotrexate), Ive got osteoporosis cos of prednisolone, depression and mood swings, sweating, palpitations etc., also have asthma and sleep apnoea amongst a host of other probs! yet i scored 0 !! I feel like im being called a liar. Worked all my life until became housebound with RA. They want me to take anti TNF drug now - does anyone know anything about it? anyway didnt want to intro myself with doom n gloom but im just so scared and nobody else seems to understand that RA can vary from day to day. Has anyone else been to tribunal if so what was it like ?

Avrielle

Oh it's horrid, isn't it? I claim ESA and I've just recieved the support component, finally! It's a horrid process, but it is possible to succeed, though I have gone through LOADS of work and research to be able to angle my way around the system. I'm not conning them or 'scrounging', just getting whats rightfully mine.

It's a good idea to write out every little thing about your illnesses and how they effect you in form of a letter. Describe what difficulties you have and make points on each piece of the form where they have wrongfully not awarded you points. Even if it sees small to you.

27th of June is not far away now. Can I assume that you have requested and recieved a Written Statement of Reasons from the dwp doctor who assesed you? Time is short, so if you don't have one then phone the DWP on the usual number for you benefits and request it. Might not reach you in time though. But if you do have it, go through it carefully and note down everything that you feel is incorrect information or wrongfully written and bring it all up in your appeal, but if a full letter is wriiten, you can send this letter to the desicion maker or give a copy to him when you attend so they can read it and keep it with your evidence. It does help your case.

The CAB, if you still have one in your area are great for helping and representing people in such situations. If you haven't already, then get in touch with them and they will give you valuable advice, info and help with your case.

It's a struggle and its not easy, espesh when you are nervous, but keep calm and try to keep everything as formal as you can, while clearly getting your points across.

The tribunial itself will usually consist of a desicion maker, a DWP doctor (they do try to not have the same doctor who assessed you there) and a third person from the DWP to witness. It's nervewracking, but it is your chance to get your voice heard. They will note what you say, they will take note of how your conditions affect you while in their presence and they will likely ask you some questions. Try not to worry too much, keep your head straight and try not to let your fear rule your head and you should be fine.

Also, the internet is great for treasured information. If you have the head for it, you can find the ESA rules and regulations official documents. Regulation 28 (I think?) is an interesting one, and it is about (loosely) that the DWP must take in to consideration if there is a consideable risk to your health if you return to work due to you being refused ESA. Unfortunately the word 'considerable' has not been given a strict definition. But certainly raise the case on how returning to work would affect you if you were refused ESA.

Wishing you the very best of luck. I've been there a couple of times myself, so I know what its like.

Love and hugs. Xx

mig

This does`nt effect me but i do wish you the best of luck with your appeal.Mig

valval

i am not much help not got to the claiming bit so am leaving positive thoughts to help you through and (((hugs)))
i hope they see sence if i remember right from what others have posted do not try to be brave if you need help ask for it, they might be watching your every move and if you can not get up out of chair with out help they should know about it or if you need stick try not to hide it this is not the time to under play i am not saying make out it worse but they need to see you as you are not as you wish the world to see you.
good luck val

barbara12

Hi barnesy
And a warm welcome to the forum, I am sorry I cant help with the meds...but I really do wish you well with your appeal..its disgusting what people have to go through for a pittance.
I will have everything crossed for you good luck xx

earthspirit

i went through hell to get DLA, which had previously been awarded at a lower rate. i found citizens advice absolutely totally useless and i was judged on what i actually looked like - sitting down - perfectly healthy at the time.

they totally messed up my claim and would not send me to be examined by one of their own doctors - the atos ones everybody seems to hate!

after a very long ardous fight, where my hands went into full flare and emergency situation and calling an ambulance because i actually thought i was having a heart attack, i won.

the atos doctor was absolutely brilliant and spent 2 hours with me, listening very carefully and putting me through all sorts of trick questions and trick physical tests.

with regards to work, even in my totally awful state i am able to be self employed and work a couple hours per day, when i am able. i still struggle to wipe my own **** and need a huge amount of time spent on me via getting care from others.

i feel physically wrecked with RA but feel that being in a situation where you are willing to do some work, despite disability stands you in a better position for getting them on your side.

i personally think, from experience of talking to people who have failed esa dla tests etc, you need to explain to them how you go about doing whatever it is you can manage to do.

ive had virtually zero good days since they actually worked out i had end stage sever RA

if you tell them you cant lift a kettle you then have to justify this with how you get your hot drinks, make or cut up food etc. if you cant explain how you manage to function i think that they think you are lying about the severity of your condition.

i spoke to the doctor about claims they refuse and she said many fail for very simple reasons like saying they cant do this or cant do that but on a sunday lunchtime this all changes when they manage to get out for a pub lunch. you need to tell her how exactly you prepare for going out and if you can do your hair, put on makeup for this event, why cant you do it any other time.

in short, you need to tell them how you cope with what you cant do rather than just tell them what you cant do. you have to show what you are doing to help yourself and what help you get from other people.

its a tricky system and you have to know how to understand the rules and what they are actually looking for

before the atos doctor left me, she gave a great deal of help in how i could managed my condition and said that the fact that i was still prepared to do what work i could was an example of how others, less disabled could do the same. . she also said it was a disgrace how my condition had been so neglected by the medical profession.

my feeling is that if you give them a totally negative outlook they will think you are shirking - you have to tell them what is positive, even very little in your life. if you present yourself as a depressed bedraggled heap then they will think its mind over matter condition you have.

fighting them (the system) definately put my overall physical condition into deep decline and i got that point across in the end.

be positive for your esa but tell them what you can do as well as the negatives and hopefully all will go well for you.

Avrielle

earthspirit makes some very good points there and are definately worth considering in regards to what you say/do at your appeal.

I'm sorry to hear that you had so much trouble with the CAB - it is unfortunate. My local CAB has a trained lawyer in dealing with benefits, so he always knows what he is talking about and I have learnt a lot from him over the past few years of claiming benefits. But sadly we had an argument over a year ago (it was something quite petty) and he now refuses to represent my cases. But I have managed just fine without his representation, though right back at the beginning I would have been completely lost without his help!

DLA is a whole other ball game. You pretty much have to be taking your last breath before they will consider giving you something. My partner got knocked back for it a few times, but he now has middle mobility componant and low rate care componant. I would love to think they will raise his care componant, so he can claim for Carers allowance, but I would never suggest him to outright ask for it because it has been known for people to have their entire benefits stripped off them for asking/appealing/requesting reconsideration to get more money/higher rate!

However, that doesn't mean to take an ESA appeal lighter than a DLA appeal. Being too prepared is almost never prepared enough.

If you have any questions, please don't hesitate to ask. xx

Avrielle

I forgot to point out in my first post here that if you have not yet requested a Written Statement of Reasons then you must keep in mind that there is a 1 month time limit in which to request the document from the date you recieved the original desicion. However, because you have already proceeded with action with an appeal, there may be special circumstances you fall into where you may still request the document.

It could be that you have to request the document in writting, giving an explanation as to why you have not already requested it. But if you phone your benefits section, or speak to an advisor at your local Job Centre, they will be able to tell you if you can still request it or not and if you can, what you have to do.

I think it's likely that it is a bit late to put a request in now as it may not reach you in time or leaves you no time to study the document before you appeal appointment. But it is always worth a try. xx

I also forgot to add that a "DWP doctor" is not actually from the DWP at all, but from the French company, Atos. They do most of the work for Work Capability Assesments and they claim to be 'unbiased' but they are hired by the DWP/government to do this work so don't let the other name put you in a false sense of security. They wont exactly bite the hand that feeds them after all.

barnesy

AW I can't thank you all enough for your support and advice. I think i do have that statement is it like a short book with all what the nurse who examined me said ? she got lots of things wrong actually twisted what i said like i said i cook and freeze food on good day so my 14 year old daughter has something healthy to eat when i cant manage and she put this down as part of a typical day ! i only manage this approx every 8-12 weeks! im not very hopeful they didnt contact my rhummy only my gp whom i havent seen re ra for years the gp didnt know me didnt refer to hosp letters and basically said i was fine could go on pub trans and everything ive had mob car for years! my own gp wrote a couple of lines for me cos he knew i was going to complain about his partner but they wont get involved with appeals. neither will rhummy they only give copis of clinic letters no letter of support so they refused me on the form i filled in the gp report and medical i attended because i was having a good day otherwise i wouldntve been able to leave the house! i just wish they could see me at home during a flare up or in the morning when i cant get up or evening when i cant lie down or sleep! i think cos ra varies from day to day its hard to explain to them and they always want yes or no answers to questions that cant be answered with a yes or no.
im not feeling very hopeful but dont know what im going to do because i genuinely know i am ot going to be a reliable employee and then ill prob get the sack! thats if i can get job in first place!

barnesy

btw sorry forgot to mention i have welfare rights supposedly helping me i havent seen anyone yet cant get hold of them by telephone, theyve told me nothing really and now they say they dont know who it is who is going to be representing me ! i just hope they turn up to court on the day!

dreamdaisy

Hello Barnesy, it's lovely to meet you and I am glad you have found us. I was so sorry to read of your arthritis and associated troubles, I am a life-long asthmatic, I had severe eczema as a child so I guess my PsA (psoriatic arthritis) was the logical development. The damage caused by that has led to OA in my knees and ankles - now that is a whole different ball game! I spent last year weaning myself off the oral steroids and now manage without them - though I recently treated myself to a 15mg boost to help me get through the Jubilee celebrations.

I am fortunate to receive the higher rate mobility component of DLA, I applied in 2007 and was granted it immediately, but this was in the days before the hoop-jumping which is now required. I was on crutches then, I have recently graduated to a four-wheeled rollator and my mobility is gradually decreasing but hey, doesn't everyone's? As for the ESA thing, well, I cannot help at all on that front. I began my own business two years before the PsA began and I am still able to work (after a fashion) although I earn a fraction of what I used (and that wasn't a fortune). Hey-ho.

There are many on here who have been through the appeals process and won. It irks me greatly that, thanks to cheats and liars, us genuine folk have to go through this ridiculous process, to be judged by the healthy who cannot get their heads around the fact that what we have does not get better despite medication, never goes away and can fluctuate so much. You have a fight on your hands my lovely, and no mistake, but I hope you can find help and support not only from us but others in the know such as CAB and DIAL. I wish you well. DD

Avrielle

What annoys me the most is that I am supposed to be healthy and fit for my age at 24. I've been disabled (not due to arthritis) for 2 years now, and it drives me mad when people think that I'm cheating the benefits system or faking it because I'm still young.

It's a horrid world!

earthspirit

i did get some support from welfare rights at the local council.
i had been referred to him after talking to a local MP
the day i went i thought i felt cool but then i just burst into tears that wouldnt stop. i was amazed that i had done that and when i stopped snivelling was able to present my own case really well.

what he said was, that he knew every question, every answer expected and would talk for me at any appeal.

as it turned out, i did it myself by letter and after that atos doctor had seen me. the welfare guy was good though because he did keep in touch and he did make sure the appeal i had written was done in the way expected. he was reassurance that if i couldnt help myself then he was there are back up. much much more than the CAB

barnesy

aw thanks again everyone for all your support. im getting more and more nervous by the day! i feel like im on trial! ill keep you all posted as to what happens and thanks again. btw i was also diagnosed in my twenties and yes people dont believe you it just adds to the frustration of this cruel condition. i also hate the way people look at you because you have a mobility card i only use those spaces when i really have to leaving them for people worse than me but it doesnt stop the judgemental looks from people why doesnt this country get on with finding real criminals and stop wasting even more tax payers money on companies like atos ? :?

earthspirit

i had a really bad impression of the atos doctors

however: you do not go to your own doctor and say oh i cant sweep the floor, dust, wash my face, brush my hair, go shopping etc, you go there to tell them what is wrong with you physically or mentally and then expect them to come up with a cure or resolution.

the atos doctors are where you tell them all about why you cant do whatever it is you cant do and explain to them how you do what you can do.

i had been told to expect 15 mins of disinterest but what i got was 2hrs of the doctor listening to what i had to say and then asking some incredibly complex questions where i had to explain in great detail exactly how i could do things or not.

if you feel that you are not getting enough time to say what it is you feel you want to say then you have to speak up and say it. if you dont explain then nobody knows!

barnesy

hi earthspirit i understand what youre saying, its just that it was a nurse i saw and her wuestions were really difficult for me to anser as she kept demanding a yes or no anser to questions that dont really have a yes/no answer but a "it depends" kind of answer and to be honest i was a bit overwhelmed about the whole situation and couldnt think straight! i wish i had the chance to do it over again - they say hindsight is a wonderful thing dont they? i would definetely be more prepared! i think i just assumed they had an insight into my conditions so i didnt have to elaborate really, how wrong was i? i just found it pretty gruelling. gooness only knows what to expect at the appeal! anyway have terrible flare up at mo again! gonna try to sleep try being the operative word! nite all chat soon. x

barnesy

hi earthspirit
just re read your first reply, i didnt come across as a bedraggled heap in fact she commented in her report that my appearance was well kempt, and when i told her i had "good days" and that i managed to cook and freeze healthy food for my daughter to take out and microwave when im bad so shes not eating unhealthy food because of my condition, (shes 14) , (i cook approx every 8 to 12 wks or so when i can), she reported that i did this on a "typical day" cooking & freezing food is not a "typical day". when i told her i could collect my daughter from school occasionally, or managed to drive to shop on "good day" for a few bits with my daughter, she also put these down as a typical day ! a typical day as we al know is being wracked with pain and swollen joints ! she also commented on things like my speech was fine, hearing etc which they are! i worked from leaving school at 15 until approx 44 (i was diagnosed with ra in my mid twenties) when i became house bound by it and had to give up hope of a much wanted baby to go on metho i have enquired about doing voluntary work when i can but you have to commit now to so many days - i can't commit to anything particularly over last 18 months as my meds are not keeping me stable having severe flare ups weekly - they want me to try anti tnf treatment next think ive exhausted alll other forms of treatment. i think its because i inadvertently underplayed my condition rather than the opposite because i was having a "good day" that im in this mess! i had a severe flare up after the medical probably cos i di exercises i was told to do and shouldn't have ? im hoping taking someone with me to tribunal for support this time will help and still live in hope that this new treatment will get back into the workforce despite my other medical conditions. chat soon much love everyone x

barnesy

:shock: :shock: :shock: hi everyone is it mad to be completely panicking because i have my appeal next wednesday and i still havent met my representative from welfare rights. my last contact from him was in march i cant get through to him by phone and their answering machine is full so cant leave message. ive emailed him again dont know if ill get reply! i havent been told anything. i shouldve had a diary sent to him 3 weeks before hearing but i havent been able to get it to him cos ive been really quite poorly for weeks now. he hasnt even contacted me for that? should i send it by courier? the last letter i sent him came back to me unopened !
I AM REALLY PANICKING !! Any ideas? x

barnesy

HI EVERYONE HAD APPEAL TODAY AND WON !!!!!!

I was terrified but to all who are having to go through this, there is a judge and a gp present and they were really quite nice! they ask you several questions and give you the chance to put your case forward. It was nerve wracking but not as bad as id imagined in my mind. It wasn't a court room like id imagined but just a room. Welfare rights had changed my support worker just before the appeal and she was absolutely lovely and answered all of my questions. I simply answered the questions truthfully - which totally contradicted what the atos medical report had said and luckily the gp knew my area and so knew that what was said in relation to distance etc was incorrect. I hope my experience gives hope to anyone going through the same thing, and once again thank you all for all of your support.

They did say the DWP could still counter appeal the decision within 28 days but fingers crossed they won't! will keep you posted. good luck everyone ! hugs.

PollySid

That must be such a relief for you, well done.
I have just read through this thread and all the way through could tell that you should get it.
I am waiting my decision and keep wondering how to appeal.

barnesy

Hi polysid thanks. Havent been on for a bit not been so good. Have you had your decision yet? im keeping fingers crossed for you! If you do have to appeal try welfare rights or cab for advice. keep ua posted and good luck x