A question.

Airwave!
Airwave! Member Posts: 2,428
edited 2. Jun 2018, 06:58 in Community Chit-chat archive
Those of you that can't work, are under the age of retirement and can't or don't pay NI, what do you expect to happen when you reach retirement age?

I would have had a full pension under the old system but will get a part pension since I am unable to work and pay for a 'stamp'.

It must be a national shame that many, through illness, will not get a full pension when they retire.

Comments

  • Airwave!
    Airwave! Member Posts: 2,428
    edited 30. Nov -1, 00:00
    Well I am surprised I had thought that there would be many more caught in a low income trap and not being able to fund their state pension due to inability to work.

    Either everyone is working and paying a stamp or on benefits and getting their stamp paid? I must be the odd one out.
  • stickywicket
    stickywicket Member Posts: 27,106
    edited 30. Nov -1, 00:00
    I'm hopeless at 'officialese' and have been unemployable since my second son was born in 1974. I have a state pension and I thought, even under the new rules, anyone who has had NI credits owing to being ill / disabled etc was OK. https://www.gov.uk/state-pension .
    Am I wrong?
  • daffy2
    daffy2 Member Posts: 1,636
    edited 30. Nov -1, 00:00
    I'm hopeless at 'officialese' and have been unemployable since my second son was born in 1974. I have a state pension and I thought, even under the new rules, anyone who has had NI credits owing to being ill / disabled etc was OK. https://www.gov.uk/state-pension .
    Am I wrong?

    That link is an out of date one, because if you google just 'state pension' you don't get the current or complete info, you have to put in 'new state pension' which gives the one below.
    https://www.gov.uk/new-state-pension
    I'm assuming it's incompetence by the DWP and/or those responsible for the web pages that leads to such lack of user-friendliness and adequate links and cross referencing.
  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User] Posts: 3,636
    edited 30. Nov -1, 00:00
    Hi Airwave
    there are ways that the stamp is paid if you are not in employment here https://www.gov.uk/national-insurance-credits/eligibility
    As you point out though, if you are not on any benefits/support allowance and are not working or any of the other qualifying criteria this means you will not be building up your state pension. You need 10 years to qualify for a basic state pension. I would suggest you contact pension wise https://www.pensionwise.gov.uk/en who will be able to look at you particular pension for you and advise you.
    Let us know how you get on because there will be lots of people in this position.
    Best Wishes
    Sharon
  • daffy2
    daffy2 Member Posts: 1,636
    edited 30. Nov -1, 00:00
    Sharon, the current wording is 10 qualifying years NI contributions 'to get any State Pension', which isn't quite the same thing.
    The pensionwise site doesn't cover state pensions; I got the impression that the original question was with regarded to reliance on the state pension?
  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User] Posts: 3,636
    edited 30. Nov -1, 00:00
    thank you Daffy,
    do you know where people should go? I have found this information on Citizens Advice https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/debt-and-money/pensions/types-of-pension/state-pension/
    I will ask our helpline staff
    Sharon
  • stickywicket
    stickywicket Member Posts: 27,106
    edited 30. Nov -1, 00:00
    To be fair to the DWP, on the link I gave, if you read down, it has a link to 'new state pension' and this was what I was looking at. I just gave the original as I wasn't sure how....er....young Airwave is. It's true, thóugh, that it does say ANY not 'full'.

    There, it says:

    You’ll usually need at least 10 qualifying years on your National Insurance record to get any State Pension. They don’t have to be 10 qualifying years in a row.

    This means for 10 years at least one or more of the following applied to you:

    you were working and paid National Insurance contributions
    you were getting National Insurance credits for example if you were unemployed, ill or a parent or carer
    you were paying voluntary National Insurance contributions
    If you’ve lived or worked abroad you might still be able to get some new State Pension.

    You might also qualify if you’ve paid married women’s or widow’s reduced rate contributions.

  • Airwave!
    Airwave! Member Posts: 2,428
    edited 30. Nov -1, 00:00
    Sticky, 63 years young! Its as I thought, a part of a pension rather than a full one.

    There must be many more in the same position or worse. You need to claim benefits to claim NI stamps. No wonder we see so many elderly people out busking in the high street?
  • stickywicket
    stickywicket Member Posts: 27,106
    edited 30. Nov -1, 00:00
    So anyone who saves the state money by not claiming benefits also finds themselves saving the state money by not being allowed a full pension :shock:

    If this is true perhaps AC and other charities could try to do something about it.
  • daffy2
    daffy2 Member Posts: 1,636
    edited 30. Nov -1, 00:00
    Sticky you're right and I stand corrected. I was so surprised to see reference to the pre-2016 arrangements first that I skimmed over the rest. I still think it's a bit odd that way round considering the vast majority of claims will be under the new rules.
    Having read further on both sites I've noticed that there seems to be some ambiguity about whether 30 or 35 years NI contributions are needed for a full(new) SP. As I already have a shortfall and too low an income to make contributions from current earnings, there was always going to be an impact on my SP amount. Adding 5 years to that shortfall will be less than helpful.....
    Wouldn't have been such a problem if I hadn't been one of those women born in the wrong bit of the 50's and so facing 4 years having been added in one lump to the already raised SPA. I am also one of the many who were not officially notified of the change.
  • barbara12
    barbara12 Member Posts: 21,276
    edited 30. Nov -1, 00:00
    I looked after my parents for many years so missed out on stamps..so I get a pittance.. :roll:
  • Airwave!
    Airwave! Member Posts: 2,428
    edited 30. Nov -1, 00:00
    Ahhh WASPIES, my oh is one so between the two of us we are quite a few pounds down per week, and the 'living wage' will never be applied to us. We are the forgotten many!

    I've been looking after the four grandchildren for seven years, which, apparentley I could have claimed for? Not retrospectively though.

    I must admit that I've spent longer with their nappies than my own kids!
  • Airwave!
    Airwave! Member Posts: 2,428
    edited 30. Nov -1, 00:00
    I await a reply from the pension advice people, I don't expect my pension forecast to change though.
  • stickywicket
    stickywicket Member Posts: 27,106
    edited 30. Nov -1, 00:00
    Me neither, to be honest. I suspect that, when you were looking after your grandchildren, either you or your children should have been paying for your NI stamps in order to qualify for the full pension.
  • Airwave!
    Airwave! Member Posts: 2,428
    edited 30. Nov -1, 00:00
    Advice from the pensionadvice government website:-
    1) Claim PIP benefits (working tax credits) and I might get my stamp paid. Or 2) Pay V NIC-voluntary contributions to fill the void.

    So, nothing changes, they don't hear the words 'unable to work'. I presume its politically driven?
  • daffy2
    daffy2 Member Posts: 1,636
    edited 30. Nov -1, 00:00
    Airwave
    This would seem to apply to your situation, but have you already gone down that route and been refused?

    https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/national-insurance-credits-for-adults-who-care-for-a-child-under-12-fact-sheet/specified-adult-childcare-credits-fact-sheet

    And yes a lot of the benefits difficulties people experience are to do with politics I reckon - the mission to reduce the benefits bill - but just as much I think is due to the sheer complexity of the system which means that even staff with training and a modicum of nous struggle to find a way through. I always remember many years ago a friend who had just started with the CAB saying she'd been shocked to realise that the then social services office would ring CAB for advice on interpretation etc. Given how much the whole thing has grown, and the changes made since then(including increasing reliance on 'the computer' and the follow-on dependence on the inadequate software that dogs government IT activities) it's hardly surprising that people fall through the holes in the supposed safety net.
  • stickywicket
    stickywicket Member Posts: 27,106
    edited 30. Nov -1, 00:00
    daffy - I think the benefits system was long overdue a complete re-haul but, like so many other things, the 'reforms' were rushed in before the money and the means were put in place.

    Airwave - I don't think it's old system v new. I don't get a full pension because I was at uni for three years (and so not working) and there was a gap between my having the kids and getting DLA - a gap which I never paid the stamps for.
  • Airwave!
    Airwave! Member Posts: 2,428
    edited 30. Nov -1, 00:00
    I did 'sign on' years ago and claim a stamp but without any benefits, I have a small works pension. They would not take my word about work and told me to sign off or they would do it. I decided to get on with my life, I found the whole business demeaning.
  • stickywicket
    stickywicket Member Posts: 27,106
    edited 30. Nov -1, 00:00
    To be fair, we can't expect 'authority' to take our word about work. Far too many (I'm sure not you) would take advantage.

    As for 'demeaning', way back in the '60s, I'll never forget an old bloke telling me he always voted labour because, when the Tories were in power (local government), at the 'Labour Exchange' as it was then called, they nailed the seats to the floor "as if any of us poor b*****s had the strength to walk off with them. That guy still had his pride. It's important, isn't it?

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