IBS recipes advice also Severe Arthritis

GalaxyA12

Found gloshospitals NHS site usefull but no recipes or such ideas.An6 experiences ideas please Eating a real problem healthily.

stickywicket

I've no recipe advice as such, @GalaxyA12 , as I don't have IBS but the BBC has lots here https://www.bbcgoodfood.com/recipes/collection/low-fodmap-recipes and, if you google IBS recipes, there are books you can buy. Good luck.

Skinny Keef

I had no idea IBS and Arthritis was connected until my doc told me a few years back.

IBS sufferer since my early 20’s and now riddled with arthritis.

unfortunately I don’t have any recipes as such, I just know what foods to avoid and to try and not get stressed out about stuff.

i still resort to not eating when I’m really bad, which apparently is the worst thing to do but it works for me. Also tramadol very much helps withthe IBS and the depression and I can’t do without it now.

Keep a food diary was good advice. With everything written down there is no ambiguity about what you can cope with.

Arthuritis

@Keef Good post! I had no idea IBS/IBD and RA could be linked, and my rheumy I suspect doesn’t either, or doesn’t want to know.

I only discovered the link by accident when I was given antibiotics and my RA almost vanished. (Antibiotics killed off all the bacteria in the bowel irritating areas where the walls had become abraded, allowing bacterial by products in and triggering inflammatory reaction. At least that’s my theory. The antibiotics improved my RA, by reducing the bacterial colonies. But it’s not sustainable to be on antibiotics all the time. I can’t repair the abraded bowel quickly either as I don’t know how big it is, but what I can do, like you, is avoid eating, but I only avoid eating something if it has fibre that would further abrade and aggravate. So been living on a little cheese & tea. Weird but it produces almost no waste. This gives my ibd a break, and as a result, there is less inflammation triggered.

Next week I have to try to explain all this to my rheumy and convince him it’s worthy of investigation.

currently not on any immune suppressant for 8 weeks. Normally I’d be doubled over in 8/10 pain after skipping one day of MTX, but here I am 8 weeks later with no meds and no ra pain.

stickywicket

I'm glad about the respite, @Arthuritis but the diet sounds horribly likely to produce other problems with so many food groups jettisoned.

I think a potential link between RA and the gut has been known for some time. But, oddly, use of antibiotics has also been linked to its onset https://bmcmedicine.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12916-019-1394-6

Arthuritis

@stickywicket Good thoughts. The antibiotics article however refers to a situation prior to active RA, where the immune system is shielded from developing tolerance.

Despite various groups researching “leaky gut” it actually still not a “recognised” condition so there is no official diagnosis for it, nor a pill to prescribe for it. This leaves regulated medicine in a paralysed state as it forces them to either think for themselves like Jenner & Marshall, (frowned upon) or pretend it’s all in the patient’s head (legally safer). Like MS & chronic fatigue etc.

It is certainly true that in our modern overly sterilised environment we are going to develop intolerances allergies so having exposure to a diverse range of bacteria early in life will help avoid those types of conditions later in life.

However even good probiotic bacteria are really bad news if they or their byproducts can cross what is supposed to be a gut barrier, but has become leaky ie abraded as in many IB conditions. This will trigger an inflammatory response to protect the bloodstream but that trigger will also send attack signal to the already primed Teff cells around your joints, giving you joint pain. (This is specific to IBD).

The key is in understanding the mechanism and forming a theory that fits my own observed empirical data.

https://www.ucl.ac.uk/news/2021/sep/targeting-gut-relieve-rheumatoid-arthritis

This research is more relevant to my case and possibly Keef & Hairobsessed if there was an external trigger to the RA. (This is known to happen with some drugs and infections eg borelia burgdorferii) I think it’s called reactive RA, with identical symptoms but when the causative agent is removed it stops.

So I am testing to see what I can do to avoid exposure in my gut to the bacteria and give it a chance to heal before having to consider the surgical route. Imagine how you might treat a badly scraped and cut arm, clean wound, keep it clean and dress it to allow healing. Avoid washing in dirty water and getting septic! Same thing here, but I can’t dress the wound!

So far based on this I am almost pain free at week 8, no MTX or HCQ, a far cry from 25mg/week MTX & 400mg/day hcq, and still barely coping with RA + numerous infections even shingles from the aggressive immune suppression that was necessary. If I am right this may help many if it can be picked up by another Dr Marshall.

stickywicket

You talk a great deal of 'uncommon' sense always 😉 and I've absolutely no desire to rain on your parade but I can help but remember that, when I had to stop my meth before operations (and, in the earlier years, this was once up to 12 weeks before - now down to one or two!) I was fine for several weeks. Just as it takes a long time to work so it takes a long tme to exit the body. Just a heads up because, as you reintroduce foods, you might be inclined to blame a particular one for the RA breaking through again whereas it could just be time. I hope it isn't and that you stay well.

Arthuritis

@stickywicket That is very true, if the MTX was covering a “milder” RA, where trace amounts would be sufficient to damp down T cell production so far as to take ages to ramp up to pain levels, and indeed, in the first week I feared as much. I could not understand how I managed 7 days, when previously being 1 hour late would restart the pain, and at 1 day it was intolerable and I was on the max dose and the rheumy said he could offer no more and I had to live with the residual pain.

However the general assumption that it takes weeks time to washout does not work in my case, I needed full 25mg without fail each week ON TIME, just to cope, not a trace residual amount as would be weeks later.

In any case the main anti-inflammatory effect comes within 24hrs of taking MTX when it causes all body cells to release adenosine, a powerful anti inflammatory agent. The folate taken after is to resume normal white cell production, in the presence of adenosine.

So suddenly stopping from 25mg would result in prompt flaring RA in my case, had it not been for something else going on.

Still, the empirical measure is at 3 months I think, isn’t that the point at which women previously on MTX are can safely try for a baby? (Trying as opposed to already being pregnant and getting a break from MTX as there is another growing competitor for your supply of folate!)

If I have it right, I should be about the same in a month when it will be 3 months off. Prob won’t get a gastroenterologist appointment in that time but I can hope. I am hoping to get visual inspection and verification but the prospect of a 35mm camera shoved up the 7th planet fills me with dread 😬 😰

frogmorton

Oooh Arthuritis your last sentence😖

Funnily enough a lot of women with RA are very well during pregnancy like the body giving us a reprieve maybe or hormones offering some protection.

I don't think anyone really knows.

All I can say though to you is the very best of 🤞 luck.

I am trying to eat 30 different fruits and veg a week to improve my gut biome watch this space too!

Toni x