OA is not a second class one!

skezier

Hi

sorry this is a bit of a bug bare with me..... my life has been trashed by oa since my teens and I hate seeing it so 'dismissed' for want of a better word.......

When I first joined here we used to kick against the label 'ware and tare' as one of the many wrong descriptions of oa. We used to say it was badly informed consultants that called it that……

Now it’s become ‘accepted’ but you know what it isn’t…. some of us got it in our teens, long before we were able to ware out the bodies.

Calling it ware and tare is like saying it’s your fault and had you been better in how you used your body then you wouldn’t have it… but guess what…

It is a degenerative condition that some get long before the label of ware and tare can be stuck on. Come to that at what age is ware and tare an expectable way of saying it! 30? 40? 50? 60? What age is it acceptable to call something that blights lives ‘just’ ware and tare?

Why is it that oa is always the one that’s implied as somehow you have risked getting or worse still your fault?!

It’s not a good label for us to be so happy to adopt! It’s a very bad label to be stuck with and gives a totally false idea as to why it happens and what it is.

While some degenerative changes do indeed come with age the ware and tare label is never a fair thing to have stuck on folks and that for me hasn’t changed or become an acceptable way of saying that’s what oa is.

Its far more than that, always has been and, for me, always will be.

For those of us oa it will bever be second class and some of us really get passionate about that one being allowed for want of a better word.

it trashed me young and I am not the only one it has done that to so maybe the forum can go back to saying how wrong the belittlerling of oa is?

I doubt I am the only one that feels this way..... Cris x

CJHunter

Hi Cris,
Wow someone who is saying exactly what i feel and believe.
I have had problems since the age of 12 and there is no way i wore my knees out by this age. Now at the age of 38 i have been told i need new knees.
Now they say i need new knees at 38 it still cant be ware n tare.
Im not 60+ wot the hell is happening.
Thanks for post Cris

traluvie

I am 32 and my rheumy calls it wear and tear arthritis i remember asking on here what that was as i had not heard of it and thought i am young how can i have wear and tear..???xx

Ps yes it does bloody hurt...

dachshund

Thank you Cris.
well said you said the truth you know because you have it the same as us,
but does a doctor know what it feels like to have oa my doc told me years ago you have wear and tear i said is it arthritis he said yes but it will get better after a few years and go.
i had pain before i was 16 i'm now 70.
14 tablets a day later and morphine and a thr tkr tripple fusion on foot i still have it.
take care.
joan xx

skezier

Hi Clare and Tracy,

It is unfair to let that one become how we describe it as well! I been lucky an none of my consultants have called it that cus I have always been too young for them to use it or they are more foreyard thinking.

My feet were rebuilt when I was 24 the first time (they have had 4 more re-fits since :roll: ) and just hate the fact that we used to kick against ware and tare as the acceptable term used and now.....

It is a degenerative condition, it is being treated a bit better in teems of it public image.... AC has done a far bit to help in fact....

Jo from the helplines we need your impute if at all possible?

Jo is one of the people who have worked hard to get OA recognized for what it really is.....

It’s so often 'dismissed' as get used t it its ware and tare... a lot don't even get the right kind of pain relief....

I been there, done that and life was meaningless! I feel very passionate about this one....

Trace your Rumo is wrong..... Some degenerative changes are normal by certain ages but the amount you have is not! You did nothing to cause it and the label of ware and tare... well guess you see it upsets me to see that one becoming main stream on the AC forum......

Jo (again from the hepllines) answered a post long ago... she was telling us about things they are finding out about oa and how it might one day be controlled as well as the inflammatory ones.

There is hope I just wish the ware and tare label could be thrown into the garbage it came from :roll:

You both take care and Tracy I so hope you soon feel a lot better. ((((( ))))) and a cuppa to you both. Cris xx

Oh Joan my friend I do wish it would be kinder to you. Its not ware and tare.... its the disintegration of cartalidge (and in my case the continuous growth of bone...) Its horrible and one day maybe it really will be treated better and not be the second class get used to it one..... we have to hope but we can't let ware and tare become main stream on the AC forum.

leaving a cappachiono and a tea with love and a hug. Cris xx

barbara12

Hi Cris
You have said it all there, I have been labled by all but one consultant...he was the first one I saw...and did say that little is known about OA..and how it progresses.
To be told its just wear and tear is so offensive , I have gone to the gym for over 20 years..and no I didnt lift heavy weights...now they say exercise will ...strengthen the bones ...well in my case it didnt ...and what I have is no less painful than others types...and if anyone knows this it is you Cris...like you say you have been there and got the t shirt....hopefully very soon things will change for the better.
Now here some slurps for you...and more for your lovely family xx

valval

this is quite interesting as suffer some kind of inflamitory arther but when showed rhummy my hands to ask if the twisting and nails were notmal he did say you have some wear and tear in your hands the thing is i am very right handed so then why would the left also be affected lol if it was wear and tear arther. i forgive him because to be honest it not his interest but even docs use it i think so as not to scare people because the word artheritis is very scary as we know i do not think they think of it as second class but do try not to scare people with something they do not know enough about but i know not all people think that way or treat it properly but it is the same in all walks of life but oa it is and always will be on here val

CJHunter

In respronse to what you have said val ,i do not think it is used in the way you suggets, maybe im just not as kind hearted as you val but i dont think that people say it to not worry you i believe that they do not understand the effect it has on daily life and is rather condisending of them to judge that you dont understand what is wrong.

IT IS NOT WEAR & TARE (as some keep posting, not here but other times), if it was it wouldnt be effecting people as young and even younger than myself.It would be caused by old age and living.

This blasted disease is stopping me from living and i just want to scream.....

bertyboy

i get the ware & tear with the DRs even now i have had a tkr +a regig on the same knee the surgeons and physio call it OA as it should be , one DR even told me it was rust when i mentioned my fingers were locking up , :roll:

[Deleted User]

skezier wrote:

Jo from the helplines we need your impute if at all possible?

As it is unlikely Jo will read this thread I have sent a message to the helpline team bringing it to their attention so hopefully you will get a response early next week.

Moderator Z

magenta

Hi Cris,

How are you? Well I hope?

This too is a bug bear for me. I have been told I have 'age-related wear and tear' in my neck. I'm only 42!!! Does that mean everyone at my age has this? I've been complaining to drs and rhuemys for years that something wasn't right with my neck-I'm sure they dismissed me because of my age. Guess what? As well as the OA, I now have a bulging disc in my neck that's pressing on my spinal cord!!!! This maybe could have been caught earlier.
I have it severe in my jaw-again, this took years of me complaining until one dentist believed I was right and now I'm probably going to have to get a jaw replacement. Again, if only this was picked up earlier but 'I was too young for arthritis'.
I now have it in my fingers, hands, thumbs, big toes and possibly in my shoulders and ankles. I'm sick of being told this is 'just' wear and tear. As if it's not as 'bad' as having RA-as someone has told me.

I feel my whole body is crumbling and no-one is interested. If I had RA though (even though I'm sero-neg), I would be offered DMaRD's and injections.
Thanks Cris for doing this thread, I've managed to get it out of my system!

Take care,

love Eileen xx

LolaCrayola

My consultant said it was 'wear and tear', my doctor said it is more than normal age related changes. Probably because I asked why my peers were not in total agony. I do not like the 'w and t' label. It enrages me.

I am 41 with spinal cord neck and nerve pain, bone pain, muscle pain and referred pain.

kev4

Had one GP tell me "It's just wear and Tear, nothing to worry about"

It made me bloody angry.

tillytop

Hello Cris and all.

Cris, I think you have raised a really good point here. Although I personally don't have experience of OA, I have seen first hand just how it can affect a person's life because my wonderful Mum in law was severely disabled by OA which started in her 40s. I have RA and the pain I get sometimes (thankfully not often) from my eroded joints makes me very glad I don't have OA. I really feel for those with OA for other reasons too because it seems that often they have no help available to them and are just dismissed by docs and told there is nothing they can do but to go away and live with it. Despite the tireless efforts of AC and the other arthritis charities, I think there is still little understanding in the wider world of the way in which arthritis can impact people of any age - and whatever type of arthritis.

Well said Cris!

Love, ((()))s and a deer nudge.

Tillyxxx

angelgirl7

Hi

Totally agree. I started getting problems in my knee at 14 and told it was "wear and tear" - how can I have worn my knee out by that age ???

Now, I am forever hearing people say "oh its just wear and tear" well its not JUST anything. And it makes me so mad :evil

Big hugs to you all

XXXXX

lindalegs

Well said Cris!!

OA is a disease just like all the other forms of arthritis.

It's painful and debilitating and just as hard to live with. x

May all those who only see it as wear and tear be thrown in the bin with the phrase itself !! :shock:

Love,

chris7

Oh Cris :sad:

I am compelled to say something here. You know how I feel on this one and am so with you. I think Jo did respond to our earlier thread on this in a positive way but I remain unconvinced we are getting a fair deal! :sad: I was diagnosed in my 40's the wear and tear seemed bizarre and unfair. At 51 it still does.

I had what had become my annual 10 minute visit to the Consultants clinic in Nov. and expected at least a fair hearing, and a further xray of the hips, I got neither. On hearing I was still working PT the Registrar who deemed to speak to me didn't listen to a word I said, and dismissed one of my concerns as nonsense! Though I was more concerned now about the pain in the knees than the hips I still got no x ray or examination and have now been told to go away with no follow up appointment at all until I need to phone the secretary and "beg for a THR" his words!!! As he never even asked what pain relief I was taking it seemed ridiculous to mention I have often crawl up the stairs on my hands and knees after work. Perhaps this is just down to cost cutting locally but I most certainly do feel OA is second class as you know. I have only seen the Consultant once in three years and now feel totally abandonned. Forgive this personal rant but it felt relevant to mention it here.

It is not wear and tear or something we have to put up with as we age but for me and you it clearly has been dismissed as such. I do hope this phrase will be binned as legs says.

I feel you may well get alot of supportive replies here. Take care Flower, I have been looking in you and hope you are feeling better these days.

love and hugs with some bestest fudge as always ((( )))
Chris xxx
PS I hope you have felt up to tackling the hawthorn?

CJHunter

Hi All, am so glad Cris has had so much support on this one.

We should stop all the second classing of O.A on here and treat all who have it as we do other fors of Arthur.

After all this forum is on Arthritis Care, not selective arthritis care!!!

hileena111

Well said Cris!!!!!!!!!!! {as legs as just typed}
Sorry legs but reading through this thread that was all I could think...."well said".
Anyway.....I was in my early 50's when this started.....but I still strongly object to the term WEAR AND TEAR.
People need more educating.
Its surprising what people with arthritisd DONT know....from being on information stands and things like that.....I get comments like "I cant park
close to the places I want to go" Do you have a blue badge {me} Oh no....i dont get DLA so I cant have a blue badge.....well if thats what people WITH arthritis think ...imagine what ones WITHOUT it think. Education is needed.
As Tilly {I think it was} said......there is less can be done for OA than RA
Painkillers or surgery and your GP....not a lot else.
Sorry if this is garbled....but it does get me mad.
Leaving you a cuppa in the stay warm cup Cris pet
Take care
Love
Hileena

valval

CJHunter wrote:

In respronse to what you have said val ,i do not think it is used in the way you suggests, maybe I'm just not as kind hearted as you val but i don't think that people say it to not worry you i believe that they do not understand the effect it has on daily life and is rather condisending of them to judge that you dont understand what is wrong.

IT IS NOT WEAR & TARE (as some keep posting, not here but other times), if it was it wouldnt be effecting people as young and even younger than myself.It would be caused by old age and living.

This blasted disease is stopping me from living and i just want to scream.....

how can you say how it was used when you were not there. i am not arguing with you but there is always two sides to an argument i do not believe anyone should be made to feel second class or be looked down on but i also feel that to tar everyone with the same brush not good either val

chris7

Hi again

Val, I mean no offence here and I am pleased you have a rhuemmy looking out for you on perhaps a regular basis but I am afraid I am with Clare as above on this one.

"This blasted disease (OA) is stopping me from living and I just want to scream" But who the hell is listening?

Unfortunately while some people who should know better can continue to call it "wear and tear," they can also continue to absolve themselves from actually trying to offer us any regular monitoring, advise or support from a specialist who could help and this leaves our poor overworked and perhaps less knowledgable GP's to try and pick up the pieces. Anti depressants do not cure OA, but just how many of us with it are taking them? I genuinely despair.

I know research is on going but am afraid it doesn't help those of us who still feel invisible and left to get on with it.

Sorry Cris you have unwittingly unleashed a **** I fear.
love
Chris xx

scozzie

I find it strange that even though OA isn't an "inflammatory" arthritis I'm still being prescribed NSAIDs in the form of ibuprofen. Did try naproxen for a few days and although it worked a real treat I had to stop as they stuffed my stomach up.

The comments made earlier fit with the fact that only a couple of my affected joints (both hands, knees, ankles and feet) show any sign of "wear and tear" on my X-rays. Plus, if it is "wear and tear" why does this disease come on so suddenly in so many joints that weren't a problem only a year ago? And some have only developed in the past three months!

Viva la OA revolution
Scozzie

roses1

Well said Cris, I have OA as you know, i am treated like its nothing! i have no more wrong with my back than the people walking in the streets! :x according to the last rheumy i saw!!!!!!! :eek: and everything is blamed on fibromyalgia i get so ''''''''angry about it :x

i have had trouble with my back and hands since my teens. fibro was diagnosed 4 yrs ago, after i had a really bad bout of flu and didnt seem to get any better, after a yr i went to docs and asked for referral.
(I was diagnosed with OA wear and tear 9 yrs previously after suffering since i was 18 !)

I dont have time now and cant find the words to describe how badly i have been treated, just go away and live with it , there's no magic pill, the overlay of fibromyalgia amplifies the pain, diet and exercise are just a few!

i am so angry and let down by these medics, my life is in tatters, i can hardly walk, i have crutches to use only sometimes as it hurts my hands and makes them far more painful, if i go to a supermarket i have to use the shopping scooter or be pushed in a wheelchair! my life has been taken away from me but its nothing!! get used to it!

I am in constant pain, my mind is still 18 but my body has told me NO!!!
I dread the waiting until its too late to do something for me to stop it getting worse. At least ppl with RA are helped to stop their disease from progressing . My mom has RA i have nursed her through the very worse of it i have seen her medication give her life back , i am at my moms worst, what help is there for me? I can tell the difference between my OA and fibro pain i have had it long enough!

Oooooo i could go on and on. Well this is a first rate disease its arthritis and b'well hurts and ruins your life!

Rose x

elnafinn

OA is a chronic, progressive disease characterised by inflammation in and around the joint space, caused by genetic, injury, misalignment or other reasons. Inflammation eventually results in damage to joint structures, especially the cartilage covering the end of each bone at the joint space.

If osteoarthritis was simply the result of normal use (e.g. “wear and tear”) there would be no advantage is subjecting the joint to the additional ‘wear and tear’ of exercise which is recommended, would there?

Perhaps we should start challenging these medics who speak to us about OA as being "wear and tear".

Elna x

skezier

Modater Z thanks for asking her. she was so good at explaining stuff and i don't remember what she actually said. I know she is a busy lady though. x

Hi Barbara, Val, Berty, Eileen, Lola, Kev, Tilly, Angel, Legs, Chris, Clare, Hileena, Scozzie, Rose, Lynn and Elna

did kinda go off on one there.... i saw something that made me fly cus the ware and tare thing (to me) is dismissive and actually I find it deeply upsetting that something that has done so much damage to me for most my life is 'ware and tare' cus its not and never has been.

I know i have knocked my self to bits and beyond... been on self destruct ever since they told me I had arthritis really..... still am but I made a choice after they operated on the back and said it was only 60% successful.

I vowed to go down fighting and I will cus after all these years I don't know any different :roll:

I get angry and very frustrated (as do we all regardless of what make of arthritis we have) It takes days to do what used to take hours and i just hate the ware and tare label..... they now tell me I have only made it this far cus I have done so much an have kept it supple and the muscles strong.. bit too strong in the case of the spasming ones

I am so sorry though that you all feel the sidelined bit..... I also known you got to fight your corner cus i didn't and now its too late for any surgery till there is nothing left to loose. even then would I be cost effective (they tell me i am not already)

Barbara you know I also find it offensive... kinda of dismissive and wish they would get into the 21st century! There is a lot of research into oa and maybe that will help shift the ware and tare label? Its going to take time and well what ever they come up with is better than whats at ground level.

Flower i really do know from my own experience its incredibly painful (as are they all) and its relentless in is nature and will only shut down via drugs. thats to a capable level mostly but no better than that cus they can't give me more than I am on with out turning me into a zombie with no quality of life........

I really think in my case the top thing is quality of life issues.

I remember very weal (and some what emotionally) the quality of life discussion i had with my rumo about the spinal oa...... I was so lucky he stepped in and filled the gap the oa had fallen into..... he does nothing to help except give me a listening ear and a ton of add ins and try these. They are helping but I end every day like us all.... payback is a bi***!

I shall stop stating the obvious and leave you a hug and a bucket of special slurps from the slurpiest one as well as the usual mugging and bounces from the rest of the employers xx

Val like you I forgive my rumo cus oa isn't really his domain and he has been kind enough to help with it even so. He has helped as well.

Flower I am not as kind as you and feel they use ware and tare as a cop out ..... its a difficult one cus you might be right its just its being said here and well its not right. Its a label we should not ware.....

Val did he suggest an xray of your hands though? They do your feet at the same time here and mine I found interesting cus they are trying to qualify for another re-fit

Why the left hand might be cus your dong hat I do.... I'm also right handed but the left arm and hand are more painful and definitely more swollen in the wrist area though the right is ahead with the hand swelling... I am aware that the left arm is stronger and I clobber the left in preference to the right cus I need the right more if that makes sense?

I so wish you didn't have this Val but glad your rumo is good. hugs and tea xx

Going to shove this through before it gets too long.....

skezier

Berty you have had too much of it flower and its just not fair. I hope they will start to give it more credence for you and help you a lot more than they are. We are at their 'mercy' at grass root level and too often it feels like its not helped enough ( mine wasn't helped at all for years and well it got me they one way ticket on to palliative care :roll: )

I used to read up about oa.... when my hope died I stopped bothering to.... maybe there is some help pending that we all will get but with luck at least the next generation ill not suffer the same (in my case) neglect.

hugs and a ton of mud for Wilf xx

Eileen thats a terrible thing to be told. No one arthritis is worse than the other they are all horrible and all take so much from us! I really wish things were different for you as you know.......

in my case the disc's went with the oa and bulge, prolapse and well flower your disc they not only could help over they rally do have to!

you have that horrible stalemate and stuck waiting for just one medic to take you seriously and well flower you must keep fighting your corner.

Just know your not alone, people do understand both your frustration and worries. Leaving you tea and a hug with a bucket of hopes. xx

Lola oh flower I am sorry your have it in the spine.... I hope your getting help with the nerve pain cus that one is horrendous at times. I also have the referred pain and flower you and your gp are right... its not 'normal' at your age... not sure that one i at any age to be honest.

I kinda wonder would your gp send you to someone else? Perhaps a pain clinic? maybe they could help more? I am so lucky to have a very good pain consultant and so wish everyone had access to someone a good a her. Maybe its something that could hep you cus backs and necks really grind you down.

I so wish I had the answer for you but hang in there. You are not alone flower and thats something that can help. Maybe your gp can thing of a way to get you some decent pain help and I really hope they will help you more. xx

Kev I so get your anger at that! Its hard to get help from the gp's and less they can operate the ortho's don't really want to know but you must fight your corner cus you have to live with it.

I know I didn't fight ( mind I was told they had waisted enough money on me I was so relived to change doctors ) by the time I broke down with the rumo it was beyond help so please keep trying to get some decent help. xx

Tilly i am sorry about your MIL. It does trash lives and it often feels like the Cinderella one. Jo did say that was changing..... there is hope then.... side glance at my palliative only sticker

Hope your feeling a bit better with the intensive weeks worth? Will go look at your post in a min, was fairly teasy earlier and just ranted and left :oops:

hugs, tea, cdm and the deer..... he is in training for his big night The sheep have got hold of some magic dust and he has been racing the seagulls See what happens when they dope out out and i still got the pain anyway xx

Angel I am right with you there flower! I also think I couldn't have worn out my knees in my teens :roll: They didn't tell me it was ware and tare though so I guess I was lucky. they called it something I cant remember but it meant I had the knees of a 80 year old..... at the time they were quite surprised.

Its not a good label to have is it? I am so with you its not JUST ware and tare and shouldn't be called it at all! Hang in there flower. xx

will shove this through again... sorry I take ages to type and the eyes are not so good either.....